Today’s post is a continuation of a discussion Preet Banerjee and I are having about the financial industry, investing strategies and money in general. The first part can be found here. Today, we discuss working with advisors, how to sabotage your portfolio and fees (my comments are in bold and Preet’s are in italics). The usual disclaimers apply about both product discussed and picking the right investment advisor for you- please do your own due diligence.
As a programming note, I am going to be running a series of “insider conversations” the rest of the year. My next insider conversation is with hedge fund consultant Richard Wilson. I am working on finding a banker and commercial landlord for you as well. If you want me to have conversations with other insiders, please give me your suggestions. Thanks.
WORKING WITH YOUR INVESTMENT ADVISOR
Let’s move on to something more practical. What do you think are the most common mistakes people make in finding an investment advisor?
On average, people don’t take their finances seriously enough; they really do take more time making decisions about a new fridge or their next car then they do selecting the person who will manage their financial lives for (potentially) decades.
It use to make me really uncomfortable when people use to hire me as a lawyer after meeting with me for 15 minutes and handing me a cheque. I am not talking about referrals from existing clients but people who cold-called me. I use to have the following rule: if I felt I could have lunch with a potential client and not bite my tongue because they were offensive/not a good personality fit/just generally crazy then I would consider them as potential clients (most people over-look that professionals pick their clients).
However, it takes time to figure out whether you could have an enjoyable lunch with somebody. How much time do you think someone should spend looking for an investment advisor?
Excellent question. I have consciously not pursued client accounts I knew I could take over with minimal effort due to various reasons similar to the ones you mention. But from the investor’s perspective, you should be spending quite a bit of time trying to figure out which advisor to use (if you choose to use an advisor). These days, you’ll certainly want to Google the advisor’s name and do your own digging. Check that they are registered with the appropriate regulatory bodies, and ask for a sample of work. Ask them how they would pick a financial advisor if they were in your shoes – you can tell a lot about someone’s character based on the level of candour you would get from an answer to that question!
What about common mistakes you see once someone hires an advisor?
A big mistake is a lack of communication with their advisor. This goes back to the average investor’s negligence with respect to their finances. Personal finance education needs to be integrated into the school system starting the year after kids start learning math and all the way up to through secondary and post-secondary education.
There should be a two-way client service agreement that outlines the expectations from each other. Also, I think many people are too polite – you need to demand more from your advisor in terms of service and accountability. If you give them slack, they will take it.
It might not hurt to “compare notes” with your friends and colleagues. You don’t have to share intimate details of course, but it doesn’t hurt to second guess your advisor’s opinions and strategy recommendations. This will require more work on your part, but shouldn’t you be more interested in your finances than anyone else? There is a danger of having opinionated friends who have no real clue what they are talking about, but appear to – so be careful.
I should point out that the average investor has multiple advisors as their asset levels grow – except at retirement when they tend to consolidate their assets to one advisor (usually a financial planner).
LEARNING FROM OTHER PEOPLE’S EXPERIENCE
I understand that you have some net worth individuals as clients or you have made an attractive ROI for your clients. Are they doing anything different than the “average” investor? If so, what is it (other than listening to their advisors!)?
Everyone gets a financial plan with full blown Monte Carlo sensitivity analysis projections run on their current plan versus what I come up with (average financial plan is 50-100 pages – I leave little uncovered). Less than 1% of advisors provide this.
Most people find that they over-estimate their risk tolerances after we go through the plan – so perhaps I reign in their expectations to a more realistic level. When people get what they expect, they are happy.
I don’t have one set investment portfolio that I use for everyone, but many are a mix of 80% passive, 20% active. I also tend to incorporate two-year flow through LP ladders. From what I’ve seen, it doesn’t really matter TOO much which one you choose in a given year, they all tend to be slaves of the sector and invest in the same entities. So if you can just keep rolling them over every year (which can be done with a two year ladder since the holding periods are generally 18 months) then you can save some serious tax. There not for the feint of heart though and even for speculative investors, the total exposure at any time to these flow-throughs is 5-10% of the total portfolio (and I might adjust the equity/fixed income split of the rest of the portfolio to compensate as well.)
What do you mean by over-estimating their risk tolerance? Do they start by saying they want to buy penny stocks and then end up with General Electric?
If anyone wants to buy penny stocks, I send them right to a discount brokerage. I was referring more to one’s perception of how much of a loss they can withstand over different time periods (1 month, 1 year, etc.), or even more to the point – what their equity/fixed income split should be. If they say then can handle a 10% drop in their portfolio, they normally can’t. If they are making regular contributions we can afford to take on more volatility, but for lump sums we normally have to reel in the equity exposure. People answer those risk profile questionnaires as if they are being graded on their knowledge of risk/return, which is the wrong way of doing it.
Let me ask the question that everyone wants to know though- what is the one thing that rich people are doing that I am not? I can tell you in business, very successful business people have a disciplined approach to cash flow management. What about investing? Any tips on how the rich invest?
For the most part, it’s more about what you put into your investments than what you put your investments into. The “rich” have simply put more money into their accounts to begin with. Along that vein, they tend to be more focused on capital preservation as opposed to new/young investors who are more focused on capital growth.
If your portfolio loses 50% in one year, just to get back to ground zero your portfolio has to return 100% the next year.
More emphasis is also placed on financial planning and taking a holistic approach to the family’s finances. Lots of time is dedicated to long term tax planning especially. I can usually add a lot more value to a family’s estate through tax planning than through improvements to their investment portfolio strategies, for example.
THE 2008 MARKET
(Please note that Preet and I had this conversation last week)
Let’s move on to how NOT to get rich. If you look at the 2008 stock market the volumes seems to indicate that the retail investors are selling while the big mutual funds and institutions are keeping cash on the side, waiting until you and I have shot ourselves in the foot and then buying up assets at discount. It is like Nortel all over again. Is history repeating itself?
It always will. People seem to forget that for every transaction, there is a buyer and a seller. So if the markets are going down, it can only happen because someone is willing to purchase the security you no longer think is worth owning. More often that not, these are the pros. I’m oversimplifying it of course, but you’ll know when things get bad when liquidity dries up – and we’re not there yet. The S&P500 corrects by 10% once every 20 months or so on average (since 1940). 20% corrections happen every 4 or 5 years on average. This is nothing new.
Some investors may naturally say “the North American markets are not good markets to invest in. I am moving my money to emerging markets.” I still believe it is too early to get into some emerging markets- there needs to be a good correction in emerging markets to get the excesses and pretenders out of the market; there are still too many fly by nights traded on the Shanghai exchange. Do you believe the same thing?
I believe too much energy is expended trying to figure that out. The world’s different markets are losing their negative correlation with increasing globalization, and North American and European multi-nationals will expand and operate in emerging markets because if anything, their management teams see the same thing you and I do. They’ll get the exposure with less risk since they are more mature companies. A lot of the emerging market entities will have teething problems – which translates to higher returns AND risk. I guess that means I’m thinking along the same lines as you: I have some exposure there, but not nearly as much as in North America, Europe and other developed markets.
Is the media making the situation worse? You would think reading the paper a recession is like the plague. It is part of the natural economic cycle.
I remember someone saying that if you left the design of elevator buttons to the media, there would be no “Up” and “Down” buttons – they would read “SOAR!” and “PLUNGE!”.
FEES
Let’s talk about fees? What are you charging?
For my fee-based accounts my client advisory fee is 1.00% ($150,000 minimum). Since I use ETF’s predominantly, the all-in expenses will be in the 1.2% range. The clients get a statement that shows how much my fee is, and for non-registered accounts the 1% is potentially tax-deductible. At the highest marginal rate of tax, that translates to a 0.54% client advisory fee. Fee-based accounts are for those who are not comfortable with their finances and need a lot of financial planning expertise and customer service. There are no costs for buying and selling on top of this (the fee covers everything).
For those using mutual fund portfolios, I can replicate their asset allocation, increase their performance and save them many thousands of dollars per year.
If they prefer, I can instead charge them by the hour and they can set up their own portfolios at a discount broker. My hourly rate is $400/hour which is also potentially tax deductible. If I can’t improve someone’s finances by at least how much my fees are, I won’t charge them. (And I’ll know that within minutes.) Why would I?
But consider I showed someone how to save $400,000 in taxes last week over what he had planned on doing and you’ll see it’s all relative.
Who is more suited to hourly vs. a percentage of fees?
Fee-based (percentage of assets) is better if you really take a back-seat with your finances. The advisor is managing the portfolio and financial planning advice and should be actively in contact with you. As the portfolio gets really big, you would switch to hourly (or fee-only).
Hourly (or fee-only) is good at lower assets levels if you are comfortable with managing your own investments – you can quantify the exact cost of the financial planning advice you are getting. You will also drastically reduce your fees in many cases. You probably won’t be as engaged with your advisor on an ongoing basis with this arrangement, so as I mentioned, this is more for those who would be pro-active in contacting their advisor for financial planning needs and/or yearly investment reviews.
Thanks for your time and thoughts. I am going to write a review soon on your book. Here’s your chance to plug it.
It is now available through www.TheRRSPbook.com.
The total cost (to Canadian mailing addresses) is $25.00 CAD – that includes tax and shipping. Considering that almost everyone who buys this book will find a way to save a lot more than $25 in taxes or fees – I think it’s a great investment. You can give it away as a gift when you are done with it – who doesn’t need to learn more about RRSPs?
It will be available on a more mainstream basis (through Amazon and Chapters/Indigo online) towards the end of February. I have yet to line up the distribution in physical bookstores, but I estimate that will take place in late spring ‘08. So if you want a copy NOW, you’ll have to order it from the website. I should point out that it’s perfectly fine to buy the book in any month other than February! These planning strategies do not revolve around the contribution deadline!
Thanks to Preet for his time and interesting conversation. Preet’s blog can be found here.